Thursday, August 20, 2009

The level of stupid is just awesome.

It's hard to believe that anyone could make us miss the relative intellectualism of Blogging Tory "Hunter", but "Dodo Can Spell" represents a whole new standard in cripping, Canadian right-wing dumbth. Seriously:

HaHaHa - Barney Frank screams at his own lefty nutjobs - HAHAHAHAHA

He says "...trying to have a conversation with you would be like trying to argue with a dining room table" without realizing that the woman he is being nasty to, is a LEFTY. How priceless is that !!!

I got to admit, that's exactly how I feel when I argue with my lefty friends. Way to go Frank!!! Now I can say the exact same thing to the nutjobs in my life and additionally tell them where the quote came from.

That lady was a "lefty?" Really? How odd, because it's not quite what you'd expect from a "lefty" -- visually portraying Barack Obama as Hitler, and his entire administration as "Nazi." So let's follow the link Dodo provides, where we read:

As I mentioned in my rambling account of my visit to Congressman Joe Sestak's town hall meeting last week, it should be known that people like the woman standing up here at Barney Frank's meeting yesterday are supporters of Lyndon LaRouche -- a radical, left-wing Democrat. The "LaRouche PAC" lettering is visible on the posters being wielded around. Efforts by the left to characterize this woman and others as conservatives or Republicans should be rebuffed, and the assertions set straight.

Apparently, "Dodo" is so stunningly ignorant that she doesn't understand the difference between Democrats and Larouche-ites.

There is a certain irony, don't you think, in Blogging Tory co-founder Stephen Taylor being a fellow at the Manning Centre for Building Democracy, while being responsible for creating the biggest danger to Canadian democracy ever -- a collection of appallingly ignorant cretins like the BTs.

It would be amusing if it wasn't so depressing. Dining room tables, the lot of them.

AWWWWWKWARD. Oh, dear. The similarities are just eerie.


Anonymous said...

Two days ago some idiot woman yelled Heil Hitler at a Jewish man who was praising Israel's national health system. The funniest thing of it, was that she was wearing a shirt with the IDF logo. Stupid comes as stupid goes.

Mike said...

Dodo is as dumb as her namesake bird. Her problem here is simplistic binary thinking. You're either right or left in her world, and no one on either side should ever call someone on the same side stupid or crazy.

(Never mind that Larouche is neither left-wing nor right-wing but just plain wingy.)

By Dodo's logic, she'll never call out John Birchers or any other loons on the left for being out to lunch or out of their freaking minds.

dupmar said...

Dodo makes any number of outrageous statements, but in this particular case, she is likely unaware of the existence of the Larouche organization, and certainly would lack the knowledge to provide a proper political characterization to such a group.

She accepts the description of this group provided by her source as “radical left wing Democrats” at face value.

Note that even blogging tories such as Fildebrandt, presumably more sophisticated than Dodo, continue to identify Hitler and Mussolini as “left wing” and “socialist”.

In this instance, some confusion may be forgiven. Larouche was at one time a leading member and theoretical guru of pretty much every splinter group on the revolutionary left before embarking on a trajectory from the revolutionary left to the radical right from the mid to late seventies, engaging in violent assaults against other left wing groups.

Former colleagues from his radical left period such as Tim Wohlforth label Lyndon Larouche a fascist, as do investigative journalists such ad Dennis King, in Lyndon LaRouche and the New American Fascism, who asserts :

“LaRouche forged bonds with the Reagan administration, the CIA, the National Security Council, the Ku Klux Klan and other white-supremacist groups, Teamster bosses and crime lords”. This appears to be a consensus among many of Larouche’s critics.

Per critics such as Chip Berlet,

“Though often dismissed as a bizarre political cult, the LaRouche organization and its various front groups are a fascist movement whose pronouncements echo elements of Nazi ideology. Beginning in the 1970s, the LaRouchites combined populist antielitism with attacks on leftists, environmentalists, feminists, gay men and lesbians, and organized labor. They advocated a dictatorship in which a 'humanist' elite would rule on behalf of industrial capitalists. They developed an idiosyncratic, coded variation on the Illuminati Freemason and Jewish banker conspiracy theories. Their views, though exotic, were internally consistent and rooted in right-wing populist traditions”. Right-Wing Populism in America

Convicted of credit card fraud and the fraudulent soliciting of "loans" from vulnerable elderly people, presumably involving space travel and the colonization of Mars, Larouche shared a jail cell with televangelist Jim Bakker. Bakker would describe his cellmate LaRouche, who received a daily briefing each morning by phone, often in German, as a “little paranoid” but astonishingly well versed in Biblical scripture.

This is what happens when you indiscriminately throw around terms like “fascism”, you may tend to overlook or misrepresent those to which the term quite properly applies.

This comment has been removed by the author.

From WikiPedia:

Lyndon Hermyle LaRouche, Jr. (born September 8, 1922) is an American self-styled economist,[1] political activist, and the founder of several political organizations, known collectively as the LaRouche movement. He has been a perennial candidate for President of the United States, having run in eight elections since 1976, once as a U.S. Labor Party candidate and seven times as a candidate for the Democratic Party nomination.

LaRouche is a Democrat. His people were protesting Bush and Cheney in the very same manner. Hitler 'staches and all. They're nuts, indeed, but they're a fixture of YOUR side of the aisle. The reason they're so upset about Obamacare is because they WANT a single-payer system like the one currently floundering in your country.

But don't let a little thing like "fact" get in your way. Please.

Furthermore, if you think the left is somehow incapable of Hitler and Nazi comparisons, look at the collection of protest photos here:

You Canucks need to take your collective, collectivist heads out of each other's rear ends. No wonder you admire Barney Frank.


The author of Dodo's link.

CC said...

Hey, Jeff, thanks for stopping by and being utterly irrelevant. Because, if you'd read Dodo's screed, you would have noticed that she was accusing the woman in question of being a "lefty." Not LaRouche. The woman.

So feel free to unleash that savage logic of yours and demonstrate how the fact that the woman is a disciple of Lyndon LaRouche makes her a "lefty."

And I'd be really, really careful about how you want to start assigning guilt by association there, Jeff. Because that's a nasty knife that cuts both ways. If you catch my drift.

Ti-Guy said...

You Canucks need to take your collective, collectivist heads out of each other's rear ends.

I never get tired of being ordered around by an American.

Fuck off, Yank.

Ti-Guy said...

They're nuts, indeed, but they're a fixture of YOUR side of the aisle.

And just when are American fringes on a side of a Canadian aisle?

Honest to God, they've become completely un-moored from reality.

liberal supporter said...

Poor Jeffy, are you envious that on average we live longer than you? And less infant mortality? I'm sure it's much harder for you, arguing with people who are healthy and are not worried about being cut off by their insurance company if they are seen opposing your lies. You'd prefer us to die off, wouldn't you?

We know your "managed care" aka death panel insurance companies are spending over a million dollars a day to fight for their continued ability to milk the few and ignore the many. Too bad downmarket types like yourself and dodo aren't getting paid.

Instead you are both recent grads of the "how to make money online" course, and your blathering is supposed to draw more people to your sites so you can get some Adsense revenue.

Don't forget the 'staches for Bush were simply to remind everyone about Prescott's treason.

Now run to your blog and post about how you've "struck a nerve" with the "angry lefties". You're sure to get a few hits from some bot searching those phrases.


Ti-Guy said...

Apparently, he's a "law student." Maybe he's going to the same school Orly Taitz got her degree from?

It's not just ignorance: it's credentialed ignorance.


Poor Jeffy, are you envious that on average we live longer than you? And less infant mortality? I'm sure it's much harder for you, arguing with people who are healthy and are not worried about being cut off by their insurance company if they are seen opposing your lies. You'd prefer us to die off, wouldn't you?

Sure thing. And I attribute it to the beer. You guys make great beer.

And, no, I don't want you to die off -- then you'd stop making the beer.

And, oh Jesus, PLEASE don't make a comparison--AT ALL--with me and Orly Taitz. You and I may not agree on much, but I attribute our disagreement to political ideology (which is fine), and not to either one of us being bat-shit crazy. That woman is a few entrees short of a smorgasbord.

You're right about guilt by association, by the way. It IS a slippery slope. But you haven't seen the LaRouche people on the streets over the past eight years -- I have. This woman has LaRouche all over her, and if she adheres to his political ideals, she comes in on the left.

Now, that makes her EXTREME fringe left and not at all indicative of even the far left's views, just like Orly Taitz is extreme fringe conspiratorial right and not at all indicative of the views of even the far right. I don't want her on my side of the political aisle, just as you likely don't want that woman in Barney's district on yours, but neither of us should ignore the fact that they're there.

And for the record, I'm sorry for ordering you around. If I may place one more order, though, I'd like it to be for one of the aforementioned beers.

-- Jeff


By "aisle," by the way, I mean the overall ideological left-right aisle, which transcends national boundaries.

Now, how about that beer?

Gube said...

I tried to send you one, but I'm still working on that matter-over-internet transmission protocol, Jeff. My apologies if you ended up getting suds in your DVD drive. :)

And yes, this Lyndon Larouche may be on the left side of the aisle, but he's quite clearly got the window seat and is hollering nonsense to people outside the building at the top of his lungs.

CC said...

Jeff writes:

"You're right about guilt by association, by the way. It IS a slippery slope. But you haven't seen the LaRouche people on the streets over the past eight years -- I have. This woman has LaRouche all over her, and if she adheres to his political ideals, she comes in on the left."

Come on, Jeff, be reasonable. It's pretty absurd to lump LaRouchites in as part of "the left," given that we on the Left think those folks are fundamentally insane.

If you want to debate this, fine. But making that kind of association is pretty infantile, wouldn't you say?


No more infantile than the press (and everyone else) attributing them to the political right. When I attended a town hall meeting here (not to scream, as I actually really like my congressman, a Democrat, because he handles himself like a representative and not a prick), it was maddening to be in line and hear the health care supporters say that the LaRouche nuts were Republicans.

Here's that piece:

I'm a guy who happens to think that the discourse is great. Even though I might not be able to change the minds of the folks here, and you might not be able to change mine, the more we get involved in the political goings on in our respective countries, the better for us all. That's why I don't like the people like Taitz, the people like LaRouche. And, for that matter, the people like Barney Frank.

I am a reformed liberal Democrat. Most of my childhood friends are still very far left. I like the fact that I can sit down and have a beer with them, talk politics, and each learn something. I'd be willing to bet that we--myself and many of the folks here--could do the same thing.

And then we could both join in and heckle the LaRouche folks. It'd be fun.

(Sorry for suggesting the cranial enema earlier. It's not like me. Like you, I get pissed when my own ideological perspective is associated with the views and conduct of someone I abhor.)

Ti-Guy said...

By "aisle," by the way, I mean the overall ideological left-right aisle, which transcends national boundaries.

Actually, it doesn't. Most Western democracies are multi-party. It's only in the US where we're seeing this kind of polarisation. The two-party system is a real problem, both in how it imposes this type of dualism on a massive complex country like the US and how it marginalises other political voices which then coalesce around these lunatic fringes because they have no other place to go.

I have a lot of sympathy for Americans. No more patience, but sympathy nonetheless.

KEvron said...

"LaRouche is a Democrat."

no, larouche is a rat.


dupmar said...

I see that Dodo has dug herself in deeper with her ridiculous rebuttal and assertion that LaRouche is some kind of “left wing Democrat”, all based on the assertions by some Republican blogger in the US that LaRouche is exactly what he claims to be.
It doesn’t enter her mind or their minds to do any independent research to test such assertions. Political organizations can give themselves whatever labels they wish, the key test is program, political activity and affiliations, not what title they post on their front door or newspaper masthead.
Not that much has changed in LaRouche’s strange trajectory from left to right. Per a January 14, 1985 article in the Washington Post, ‘Ideological Odyssey: From Old Left to Far Right’
“The organization's ideology is hard to pin down. The NCLC started in the late 1960s as a left-wing Marxist sect and then shifted to the far right in the mid-1970s. Its philosophy now is a thick stew of political ingredients. Some people have publicly expressed doubts that the shift to the right was authentic and believe LaRouche is secretly still a Marxist. “

“With the move from left to right, the group's perceived enemies shifted as well. But one fear remained constant: that LaRouche is branded for assassination. “
“‘There is some horrible psychological craziness in this group,’ said one defector. “
“Some former members speak fondly of these days of leftist fervor, because they said things started changing in mid-1972…. “LaRouche began to become more strident in his attacks on perceived foes, said ex-associates and experts on the group. At his urging, many members learned karate and street-fighting techniques, they said.”
“In April 1973, LaRouche ordered members to attack members of the Communist Party (CPUSA) and others in a plan called "Operation Mop-up," according to ex-members and published reports.”

“In the following months, there were about 40 fights at gatherings of Communists and others, according to former associates of LaRouche and published reports. Many people were injured, and some LaRouche supporters were arrested, but there apparently were no convictions.”
‘‘Mobile squads of helmeted, club-wielding goons invaded bookstores and offices of the CPUSA, Socialist Workers Party and Peking-line groups, attacking their members there and on the street,’ said the study by journalist Rees.”
Now this sort of activity may be par for the course for right wing libertarians allied to the Republican cause , that is classical fascist type behavior, certainly not what one would expec t of “left wing Democrats”.

dupmar said...

To continue with the Washington Post article:
“At the time, LaRouche berated his followers for not being tough enough and criticized those who tried to avoid participating in the fights, according to ex-members and persons knowledgeable about the group. “

“‘People would be called on the carpet to explain themselves,’ said one former member. ‘They were told, 'If you thought this was bad, wait until the revolution, when people would be carrying guns.' "

"There was a tremendous emphasis on being psychologically ruthless: 'Can you guys really take it?' " another said. "Mop-up" started the organization's move toward being a "security-conscious, paranoid, 24-hour-a-day thing . . . . It changed the organization psychologically."

“LaRouche developed a set of theories he called "Beyond Psychoanalysis," and he and other top leaders held grueling sessions with members, grilling them about their lack of toughness, their sexual feelings or other supposed problems, according to ex-associates and internal documents.”

“‘People were compelled to confess in front of a group the most personal things about their sexual lives, personal lives,’ one former associate said. LaRouche's basic approach was, ‘Look what a wretch society has made of you, an infantile, impotent being, the ex-member said. “

“LaRouche said that only he could help his followers, and many begged to have sessions with him, former members said. Members were gripped with a "virtual religious hysteria" when they saw these criticisms as insights, one former associate said.”

“In an interview LaRouche said it was around 1973 that he began to become concerned about his personal security. “
It was around this time that LaRouche transformed his organization into some version of a Gitmo camp that only in the fevered imaginations of Republican bloggers and their blogging tory acolytes can be equated with the Democratic Party.

dupmar said...

“Tapes, released to reporters, of LaRouche "deprogramming" White show LaRouche shouting at White, sounds of weeping and vomiting, and complaints by White that he is being deprived of sleep, food and cigarettes, a published report said. LaRouche said White was not mistreated, according to the report.”
“Dozens of members begged LaRouche to deprogram them, too, ex-associates said. A number of members were interrogated for a few days at a time by the group's security squad, according to former members and published reports. “

“The group's public and internal publications around that time were filled with graphic references to members' fears and dependence on LaRouche.”
‘Your parents are immoral,’ the group's members were told in an internal bulletin several years later. ‘The people of the United States are not morally fit to survive . . . . Everything your parents say is evil -- they are like lepers, morally and intellectually insane.’"
Take note of the reference to lepers, someone has been channeling LaRouche.
“The change in the group prompted many of LaRouche's early followers to quit.”
“Because of the perceived danger of attack against the group, LaRouche set up a security team within the group to protect himself, said ex-members and others familiar with the group.”
“Some LaRouche associates were trained in the use of guns, knives and other weapons at a "counterterrorism" school in Powder Springs, Ga., according to former members and other sources. The school was operated by Mitchell WerBell III, a former guerrilla operative for the Office of Strategic Services (OSS) and an international arms dealer with whom LaRouche grew close. “

“WerBell, a soldier of fortune with contacts around the world, introduced LaRouche and his followers to numerous military and intelligence officials, according to ex-associates and other sources. “
“In the mid-1970s, LaRouche began to describe intricate plots against the group by the CIA, the Rockefellers and others, the group's publications show.”

“Around that time, the group, by then better described as conspiracy-minded than left-wing, began making alliances with groups that shared its concern about supposed secret plots and conspiracies -- the radical right wing. The NCLC's turn to the political right "happened without most members realizing it," according to one former member. ‘It happened through this hysteria.’"

“One man with whom LaRouche and his group dealt in the mid-1970s was Willis Carto, the founder of the Liberty Lobby, according to LaRouche's deposition in a libel case last year and one by Carto in another lawsuit. “

“The Liberty Lobby, a right-wing group, has said it was never allied with LaRouche. Carto said in his 1980 deposition that the Liberty Lobby never endorsed the NCLC but that he was "quite impressed" with its members and that his organization's newspaper, Spotlight, had praised it.”

“Another man LaRouche met in the mid-1970s was Roy Frankhouser, LaRouche said in a deposition. Frankhouser, then a top official of Pennsylvania's Ku Klux Klan, pleaded guilty in 1975 to dealing in stolen dynamite. He had also been an informant for several federal and local law enforcement agencies, according to published accounts. Frankhouser has sent the LaRouche group "intelligence" about a range of subjects, former members said. “

“LaRouche said in a deposition that his organization has paid Frankhouser for various services. LaRouche said Frankhouser is "a good man on security" who works to spot "nasties" who pose threats. According to a July 9 LaRouche deposition, Frankhouser had been working for the organization as recently as one week earlier. “
Alliances with right wing libertarians, soldiers of fortune, arms dealers, fascists and Nazis, yes that definitely is the work of the Democratic Party, this is precisely the sort of company they would be expected to keep.

dupmar said...

The Post article continues :
“Despite the group's right-wing allies and conservative rhetoric, some critics say they doubt that the LaRouche organization truly abandoned its leftist principles and believe it merely faked a conversion to the right” -- yes this is precisely the argument Dodo is making, forget all the other evidence, the man claims he supports the Democrats, forget the fascist associations, take him at his word on this..

“The Heritage Foundation said in a July report that despite LaRouche's appearance as a right-wing anticommunist, he takes political stands "which in the end advance Soviet foreign policy goals."

“Daniel Graham, former director of the Defense Intelligence Agency, the Pentagon's intelligence arm, and a longtime LaRouche critic, said he believes LaRouche is an "unrepentant Marxist-Leninist" who faked the move to the right "to suck conservatives into giving him money." Some other former high-ranking intelligence officials, mostly conservatives, said they join Graham in this belief.”
“One recurring theme of the LaRouchian ideology is that the world faces nuclear war or world starvation unless his ideas are implemented, according to LaRouche's writings.”
“In the last 10 years, LaRouche has issued countless warnings that the world was doomed in the coming months, according to the group's literature. “
Yes, quite definitely, LaRouche is an unrepentant Marxist, a lecturer on Hegelian philosophy, who only pretends to advocate fascism, to befriend mercenaries, arms dealers and Klansmen, all in an effort to takeover, disrupt or destabilize the Democratic Party.

Mike said...

Thanks for the WaPo stuff, I guess.

But it seems to me that what Dodo and that Jeff fool are missing, and commenters here aren't putting enough focus on, is that it doesn't matter whether Larouche is on the right or left, assuming he can be categorized as one or the other.

Barney Frank shot down someone for calling health-care reform, Obama and Frank himself "Nazi". He called someone on bullshit that shouldn't be countenanced, the kind of slander that deserves retaliation regardless of where the speaker lies on the political spectrum.

Left versus right is irrelevant here. It's not Blue team versus Red team. This is about decency and respect.

Gene Rayburn said...

If I was Jeff, I would have been more offended to be connected to Dodo.

Unknown said...

You Canucks need to take your collective, collectivist heads out of each other's rear ends. No wonder you admire Barney Frank.

Fuck off, you American shitbag.